I am new here boys and some my know how I am some my not. In most cases this is a good thing

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I thaought i would start a Discussion on why you would want to go three phase and Why

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3 Phase motors are less $ to run, less $ to buy if you have steeped over the fear and remain a SPOB(Single-phase office boy).

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Three phase electiricty comes in either 3 wire or 4 wire power configurations  3 hot wires and no nuetral or 3 hot wires and a nuetral respectively. Each hot leg is 120 degrees out of phase with each other.

Basically when looking at motors here are the advantages of 3 phase motors:
They are more efficient than single phase motors
They last longer and run smoother.

3 phase motors are smaller per unit of horsepower or Kilowatt than a single phase motor.

The disadvantage of 3 phase motors is that they cant be used at most residential places because typical homes use single phase electricity. Â A Â phase converter can be used to convert single phase to 3 phase. There are static as well as rotary converters, and variable frequency drives. All these converters do a farily good job of converting single phase to 3 phase.

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The greatest part about getting three phase in the shop is cheep industral tools can be had for next to nothing.

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I just finished a system for my shop out of used industrial equipment and now have 208/240/and 600volt three phase of my residential single phase power

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I have a Ceadarberg 10 HP vintage RPC (Got used off CL).  I have placed the RPC in a sound proof room that is just lacking a door right know. It may need cool with a fan set to a thermostat ,any ideas how to do that cheep.The hole system is used parts thanks to many of my friends. Thanks boys you know who you are.the RPC had no  starter on it and I would throw the breaker and once it was running i had to go over and throw the toggle to switch out the start caps. Â
I thought that a time delay switch could just replace the toggle the relay is adjustable from 1 to 15 sec) and it  trips out the start caps.  Then when I kill the power it resets so the RPC is ready to start again.
I have 120volts in the box and that is the voltage of the control wiring and coils( no control voltage transformer). I have added other control stations around the shopso i can start and stop the rotor Phase converter in a few locations. The starter is a # 3( rated for 90 amps and I have yet to find an overload to protect the idler.  Â
here are some pic of what were i am to day.
idler in sound proof room
the guts and caps and mercury switch. all i have done is extend the two wires for the toggle to the control box  Â
the toggle ended at a block in control box.
the TDS   i need a relay too  overall system

The TDS (time delay switch) works really good. i could not be happier. Â

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Is there a resident Electrical guy?Â

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please share your three phase experiences.

What are you guys doing for your High voltage machines?

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jack

English machinesÂ

Can some fix my pics? How do i get them to show?

Where I live, there is no 3 phase available- residential area. So I would have to go with a converter. Not sure it would be cost effective for me.

Hi Jack. I too am on residential currant. I use a rpc from American Rotary from Wisconsin. They made the box and I supplied the motor. Never have a problem. Its quiet and does what I need. Its a 5 hp unit. I run 2 shapers, a disk sander, a unisaw and a mortiser. Never had anything that runs at 600 volts. I think that is only up by you. Mine is all 220.

 

Sorry I can't help you more. Not sure if there is a resident electrical guy. We do have some pretty smart folks though. Hope you can find out what you need.

You can add any pictures here you want by clicking on the image link in the box at the top. It is the second one in from the left. No more hosting pictures somewhere else to post here. Try it, you will like it. bob

 

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Bob Kloes
www.bobkloes.com

I have also been using a RPC from American Rotary ... I highly recommend them. Great customer service. I bought mine a couple years ago and received a call from the owner a couple weeks after I bought it. He just wanted to make sure everything was working and too see if I had any questions.

 

Another great thing about 3 phase motors is they seem to last forever and are piece of cake to tear apart and rebuild.

I am still using VFD's. I dont expect to run anything over 3hp at this time. I really only have 1 more machine to locate, but we all know how that goes. I do have a 10hp 3ph 1800 rpm motor here that I picked up cheap if I do ever decide to build an RPC

 

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My job is to give my kids things to discuss with their therapist

That's what I thought when I bought my 7.5 hp RPC. Now I wish I would of went with a 10 hp.

My Crescent planer, which I sold last month, use to push the limits of the 7.5. So far the big Newman planer seems to work fine one it.


Ken Rasmussen said:

I am still using VFD's. I dont expect to run anything over 3hp at this time.

 

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My job is to give my kids things to discuss with their therapist

The only remaining machine is a planer. I am looking for PM100 in 3hp. My jointer is 8", and single phase RI, so I won't need anything larger than 12". Plus I don't have the room for a large planer either.


Shane Whitlock said:

That's what I thought when I bought my 7.5 hp RPC. Now I wish I would of went with a 10 hp.

My Crescent planer, which I sold last month, use to push the limits of the 7.5. So far the big Newman planer seems to work fine one it.

Ken Rasmussen said:

I also wish mine was bigger, but I guess most of us think that way. ;>)

 

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Bob Kloes
www.bobkloes.com

I went through the whole single phase/three phase dilemma when I built the house and barn eight years ago. My local utility (PSE&G) offered up three phase power at $60k for installation. I ended up sticking with single phase. Since I was building the service myself, I ran high voltage (13,500V) to a transformer right next to the barn. From the transformer, I ran copper cable (1250 kcmil) to the current transformers. From the CT cabinet, the service splits to two disconnects rated at 400 AMPS (one for the house and one for the barn). From the disconnect I go into a 400 AMP panel that services the shop.

All of this adds up to a big ugly mess on the side of the barn. If I find some pictures, I'll add them to the thread. I had been rat holing three phase machines for a long time before this, so I already knew I needed a converter. I looked at buying one and just couldn't justify the cost. I needed a 20 HP, and prices at the time were staggering. I already had some NOS motors laying around so I went down the road of building my own. This was a bit of an experimental process for me. I ended up with a configuration that consists of a 20HP motor, a potential relay, a bunch of start caps, a bunch of run caps, a terminal strip and a steel enclosure bolted to the motor. The whole thing cost $160 to build (including the several start caps I burned up in the process). I installed this contraption under the stairs in the shop and haven't had to touch it in seven years. I have to start it from the breaker panel (no remotes), but this hasn't been much of a hassle.

Coming out of the RPC, I go into a three phase panel. I also have transformers to get me to 480 and 600 volts for my Canadian/English machines.

In the past few years I've also added some big VFD's to the mix. I was fortunate to come accross two Danfoss 10 HP VFD's that could be run from single phase. I use these to power the dust collector and some of my shapers that require 120 cycles for full speed.

The bottom line here is that the RPC has been so reliable that I doubt that I would ever switch to three phase utility service unless it was at no cost.

 

AF

Somerset, New Jersey

http://www.owwm.net

Arthur

 

There largest residential service i could get here is 200amps so i up graded that a few years ago. 400amps would be nice.

Bob Nelsn has a great plan on PDF @.practicalmachinist.com

link

.practicalmachinist.com

 

Good to be able to share in a fourm with you Arthur. looking forward to it.

 

 

Jack

English machines

I set up a 10hp RPC.  I bought a control panel from these guys  :http://elimiaindustrial.com/

I paired it with a surplus India import motor that is whisper quiet.

 

I have a 200 amp service with a 100 amp feed/panel in the shop.

My RPC feeds a MLO GE A series 3 phase panel with individual breakers for each machine. 

 

I figure that when I finally get to the point of buying a large wide belt sander I will have to find a different building.

 

As promised above, here is a picture of the side of the shop with the service entrance, current transformers and disconnects. Fortunately, this is not visible from the house side of the building.

 

 

AF

Somerset, New Jersey

http://www.owwm.net

love that building Arthur

 

jack

English machines


A said:

As promised above, here is a picture of the side of the shop with the service entrance, current transformers and disconnects. Fortunately, this is not visible from the house side of the building.

 

 

AF

Somerset, New Jersey

http://www.owwm.net

Thanks Arthur. Nice sunset! bob

 

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Bob Kloes
www.bobkloes.com